ROTS | Sidious vs Windu Discussion

Kilius wrote:He threw the fight as a last minute improvisation in the novelization

Meatpants wrote:Yeah but in the novel, Windu uses shatterpoint to disarm him.

Meatpants wrote:The shatterpoint was Anakin’s fear

Meatpants wrote:You're misinterpreting the quote. Sidious having fear and Windu thinking the fear he senses is Sidious' are two different things.

Meatpants wrote:No, they're two separate events. Sidious naturally uses fear because he's a Sith. But Windu thinks that the shatterpoint was Sidious' fear, when it was actually Anakin's. That doesn't mean Sidious wasn't still fearful.

Kilius wrote:Again the question isn't what the shatterpoint was, the question is in why Sidious hesitated which makes no sense if you assume the source of fear Mace sensed was from Anakin. Sidious has no logical motive to hesitate if he wasn't afraid.

Meatpants wrote:He legit won in the context that Anakin, an outside influence, affected the duel.

Anakin Skywalker no longer had shatter-points. He was a shatterpoint. The shatterpoint. Everything depended on him. Everything.

SithArchaeologist wrote:Even disregarding Mace's outright victory as perhaps circumstantial, the novel still describes them as fighting in a perfect stalemate. Mace was deflecting Sidious' power back at him "with ease," and he was focusing his efforts on finding shatterpoints.

Meatpants wrote:

SithArchaeologist wrote:Even disregarding Mace's outright victory as perhaps circumstantial, the novel still describes them as fighting in a perfect stalemate. Mace was deflecting Sidious' power back at him "with ease," and he was focusing his efforts on finding shatterpoints.

Ummmm

"You're the chosen one, Anakin," Mace said, his voice going thin with strain. This was beyond Vaapad; he had no strength left to fight against his own blade.

Revenge of the Sith wrote:Mace was deep in it now: submerged in Vaapad, swallowed by it, he no longer truly existed as an independent being.
Vaapad is a channel for darkness, and that darkness flowed both ways. He accepted the furious speed of the Sith Lord, drew the shadow’s rage and power into his inmost center—
And let it fountain out again.
He reflected the fury upon its source as a lightsaber redirects a blaster bolt.
There was a time when Mace Windu had feared the power of the dark; there was a time when he had feared the darkness in himself. But the Clone Wars had given him a gift of understanding: on a world called Haruun Kal, he had faced his darkness and had learned that the power of darkness is not to be feared.
He had learned that it is fear that gives the darkness power.
He was not afraid. The darkness had no power over him. But—
Neither did he have power over it.
Vaapad made him an open channel, half of a superconducting loop completed by the shadow; they became a standing wave of battle that expanded into every cubic centimeter of the Chancellor’s office. There was no scrap of carpet nor shred of chair that might not at any second disintegrate in flares of red or purple; lampstands became brief shields, sliced into segments that whirled through the air; couches became terrain to be climbed for advantage or overleapt in retreat. But there was still only the cycle of power, the endless loop, no wound taken on either side, not even the possibility of fatigue.
Impasse.
Which might have gone on forever, if Vaapad were Mace’s only gift.
The fighting was effortless for him now; he let his body handle it without the intervention of his mind. While his blade spun and crackled, while his feet slid and his weight shifted and his shoulders turned in precise curves of their own direction, his mind slid along the circuit of dark power, tracing it back to its limitless source.
Feeling for its shatterpoint.

Meatpants wrote:How does this address the fact that Mace disarmed Sidious via Anakin's shatterpoint?