RotS Sidious vs RotS Dooku and DD Vos

Troubled by Asajj Ventress' growing prowess with the dark side of the Force, Darth Sidious commands Count Dooku to eliminate her.

Though Asajj devotes her service to Dooku, the Count is loyal to Darth Sidious, who sees a threat in Asajj's growing power and orders her killed.

Sensing Ventress' growing strength in the Force, Sidious orders Count Dooku to kill his apprentice.

"I shall teach you the ways of the dark side. Soon, your powers will rival that of the great Sith Lord Darth Maul. We will be even more powerful than Lord Sidious."

Rohirrim wrote:

Troubled by Asajj Ventress' growing prowess with the dark side of the Force, Darth Sidious commands Count Dooku to eliminate her.

-StarWars.com, Nightsisters Episode Guide.

-StarWars.com, Count Dooku Biography Gallery.

Though Asajj devotes her service to Dooku, the Count is loyal to Darth Sidious, who sees a threat in Asajj's growing power and orders her killed.

-Star Wars: Women of the Galaxy.

Sensing Ventress' growing strength in the Force, Sidious orders Count Dooku to kill his apprentice.

-Ultimate Star Wars New Edition.

"I shall teach you the ways of the dark side. Soon, your powers will rival that of the great Sith Lord Darth Maul. We will be even more powerful than Lord Sidious."

-Count Dooku, to Savage Opress (TCW S3E13).


Both Sith Lords seem to think that two Dooku tier characters could beat Sidious, so I'd bet on the team.

Rohirrim wrote:@Latham2000: I only stated my interpretation, what they "seemed to think" to me and what "I'd bet". I don't imagine that Dooku would want Ventress to surpass him, and Dooku wouldn't likely grow faster than his Master, being older than him and having less potential. If you have a different interpretation and want to share, please do.

BoD wrote:Ventress was ragdoll tier for Dooku. Him being wary is meaningless.

Quin is only a good match for Dooku because of his fighting style. Against Sidious, he goes down fairly quickly. Dooku puts up a decent to decent fight (better than Maul and I doubt he gets ragdolled) but ultimately goes down.

Isv wrote:

BoD wrote:Ventress was ragdoll tier for Dooku. Him being wary is meaningless.

Quin is only a good match for Dooku because of his fighting style. Against Sidious, he goes down fairly quickly. Dooku puts up a decent to decent fight (better than Maul and I doubt he gets ragdolled) but ultimately goes down.

Yeah, I mean that's really the thing. Ventress literally got ragdolled in their 1v1 after she was supposedly "a threat to sidious", so it really just comes down to Sheev not wanting another liability on the board

O-Siri wrote:Sidious got 'ragdolled' by Maul in the Lawless deleted scene. Anyone in canon can be gripped or pushed if they aren't in position to defend themselves. Stop pretending Force barriers are a real thing with TCW or the Movies. Dooku softened Ventress up before he yanked her sabers away and later she redirects his own blade with the Force. Ventress as that currant stage probably wasn't enough for Dooku to overpower Sidious given he submitted to his master in the end, but Vos at his peak is on Dooku's playing field.

Sidious got 'ragdolled' by Maul in the Lawless deleted scene.

Anyone in canon can be gripped or pushed if they aren't in position to defend themselves. Stop pretending Force barriers are a real thing with TCW or the Movies. Dooku softened Ventress up before he yanked her sabers away

and later she redirects his own blade with the Force.

Ventress as that currant stage probably wasn't enough for Dooku to overpower Sidious given he submitted to his master in the end,

but Vos at his peak is on Dooku's playing field.

BoD wrote:

Sidious got 'ragdolled' by Maul in the Lawless deleted scene.

Key word: deleted. It's not meant to be considered canon.

@O-Siri: Just a technicality. Lets be honest if there were a deleted scene of Obi-Wan Force pushing Dooku or Anakin overpowering Mace people would be dog piling all over it. 

The fact the scene even made it to that stage is evidence the creators of TCW don't believe in Force barriers and pushing or even gripping someone is just a matter of skillful timing; much like landing a kick or punch, and not being more powerful.

Anyone in canon can be gripped or pushed if they aren't in position to defend themselves. Stop pretending Force barriers are a real thing with TCW or the Movies. Dooku softened Ventress up before he yanked her sabers away

 
She was in a combat stance and fighting him. It was pretty obvious he was a lot more powerful than her. 

@O-Siri: You can be in a combat ready stance and still not be in a position to defend yourself. TPM Kenobi was in a combat read stance when Maul pushed him yet the script says he was caught off guard, obviously you can't be prepared for everything. Anytime you are attacking and not defending you are vulnerable to counters, which is what Kenobi was doing when he got tagged by Maul in all his TCW fights, and it's the position Sidious was in when Maul gripped him; he was in the middle of a lightning barrage and Maul took a chance and gripped him when Sith Master wasn't in a position to defend himself.

Ventress was Force pushed into a wall and was momentarily stunned and Dooku was quick to follow up. If he could have done that from the begging he would have. He had a situation in a powerful renegade Sith running rampant and had no time to play around.

and later she redirects his own blade with the Force.

Moving a blade several inches when your opponent thinks you're defeated and is caught off guard =/= being blasted across a room and being casually disarmed in the middle of a fight. 

[size=13]@O-Siri[/size]:Yeah Dooku is superior to her obviously but it doesn't excuse the fact that his imaginary Force barrier didn't prevent his blade from being manipulated.

Ventress as that currant stage probably wasn't enough for Dooku to overpower Sidious given he submitted to his master in the end,

...Or it's because Sidious essentially told Dooku if he didn't kill her, Sheev would kill him. 

@O-Siri: And if she was powerful enough Dooku could have deified him. I agree she isn't threat to Sidious yet, just in the future if she continues to grow.

but Vos at his peak is on Dooku's playing field.

Vos' unpredictability is literally what's noted to put him on Dooku's level. 



This advantage against Dooku definitely doesn't extend to Sidious.

@O-Siri: Styles make fights I agree, but there's also levels to this. He was also a microsecond faster than Dooku in the same fight when they both tried to Force grab a lightsaber. His stats at this point in time are relative to Dooku and the stylistic advantage was enough to give him the edge.