Rank these powers gaps

Caedus grabbed his meditation chair in the Force and discovered that he could not turn it back toward the battle. No matter how hard he exerted himself, it would not budge.

Krova reported that the Hapans had sealed the Confederation's escape route and were now fully engaged.

Caedus gave up on the chair-he couldn't see anything useful through the bubble anyway-and dropped into the seat facing away from the battle. Instead of leaving his legs stretched out in front of him as they had been before, he drew his knees up to his chest and felt no less foolish.

- LotF: Inferno

She felt the breath of cold air behind her. Metal rasped. Tahiri had dislodged whatever had jammed the hatch, and when Jaina turned, she saw Tahiri scrambling through the deckhead. There was blood everywhere on the deck; Mirta was on her knees, clutching her throat one-handed.“Your shabla brother,” she gasped. “He’s up there.”

The Moffs lay dead. Jaina felt Jacen then; he was throttling Mirta to let Tahiri escape into the docking tube above the hatch. Jaina put every scrap of strength she had into breaking Jacen’s invisible Force choke hold on Mirta. She saw it like a black chain and visualized the links flying apart just as Carid shot past her and scrambled up the ladder followed by Vevut. Fett skidded to a halt and grabbed Mirta by her shoulder, as if he thought the blood on the deck might be hers.

“I’m okay,” she said.

“If he’s hurt you, I’ll break my own rule and take a long time killing him,” Fett said.

“Don’t worry.” Mirta rubbed her neck. “I got my own Jedi…”

Legacy of the Force VIII - Revelation.

King Joker wrote:Ban! Ban! Ban!

Spoiler:

It's of little significance compared to Luke's lack of exertion, hence why they're compared like that in the sentence.  

A factor? Yes.  The defining one? No.

I've already explained why it doesn't matter.

Luke breached Jacen's active TK barrier in Revelations.  He wasn't taken by surprise then.

Your rationalisation for this is unsubstantiated by the text and unsupported further examples in the lore.  Within the text, Luke is using his TK to mess with the Starship - Jacen tries to block him - Luke then TK rapes Jacen with power he didn't realise could be mustered.  No event of charging up magica-points happened in between those instances.

Not to mention that after Luke effortlessly pinned Caedus to the chair aboard the Anakin Solo, while not in the room, still presumably exerting the same amount of effort (ie: none) he could freeze Caedus' meditation chair to the spot... which - no matter how hard he tried - Caedus couldn't budge an inch.

That'ss a pretty strong indicator that Jacen is a mouse to Luke... and well within the ragdoll range when using any meaningful degree of his "baseline" power.

... On the other hand, Jaina successfully broke Caedus' TK choke on the Bounty Hunter, Mitra Gev :

It's pretty funny.  

Luke can exert no effort what-so-ever... and yet objects - including Jacen himself - can be frozen in space without the Sith pretender's ability to do anything about it.  Yet Jaina can actually stop her brother's TK influence over other people with a lot of effort.  

But according to darthcaedus77 - on numerous occasions - Jacen can ragdoll her... yet Luke can't ragdoll him.

Revelation wrote:He could Force-push their attackers, or grab her to free her, or snatch the cutters, but that would just open the rip in the docking tube, too. He couldn't do it all. He was still exhausted from the effort of the battle link and bringing down Fondor's defenses.

DC77 (Reborn) wrote:
Why is it of "little significance"? Less significance? Sure? Little? That requires further substantiation.

Luke starts his attack several seconds before Jacen throws up a defence, ie: he's been charging up longer and thus is prepared to meet resistance. Jacen's barrier is pretty much summoned in an instant. This isn't a particularly difficult point to grasp. 

Caedusfan wrote:
The chair feat by itself doesn't indicate a one shot gap. And, guess what, a quick skim through Revelation was all it took to unearth the context to the Jaina choke (Debunking your whole comparison), context you disingenuously omitted:

"
He could Force-push their attackers, or grab her to free her, or snatch the cutters, but that would just open the rip in the docking tube, too. He couldn't do it all. He was still exhausted from the effort of the battle link and bringing down Fondor's defenses."

- LOTF Revelation
"

So, Jacen's running on empty here.  Moreover he's choking out a lowly non force sensitive, and thus probably employing a fraction of his usual force. To cap it off killing Mirta wasn't the objective, letting Tahiri was, and low and behold, she escaped. Given this I see no reason for Jacen to attempt to continue the choke.

LOTF Revelation wrote:

The adrenaline and pure white rage looping back to him from the individual commanders made his throat tighten. It was almost like a back-pressure effect, that the passion for the battle that he was channeling into them gained power and momentum, and syphoned back into him as a changed and magnified thing that he felt he had to vent from his chest or scream.

He was out of breath. He hoped nobody noticed. It might have looked as if he were panicking.

[...]

Caedus saw what the Fondorians operating the shield facility might see; he had no idea what the actual location looked like, but he didn’t need to waste his strength projecting his consciousness to actually observe. Any imagined scene would do to focus him as the torrent of anger and raw nerves of a hundred or more commanders poured back through him.”

 Moreover he's choking out a lowly non force sensitive, and thus probably employing a fraction of his usual force. To cap it off killing Mirta wasn't the objective, letting Tahiri was, and low and behold, she escaped. Given this I see no reason for Jacen to attempt to continue the choke.

DC77 (Reborn) wrote:Geography HW or Jacen lowball. Which is it to be.

It's of little significance compared to the effort put in (Ie: none) from Luke, as evidenced by the use of the word "while" and how much more elaborately his lack of exertion - in contrast to Jacen's utter helplessness "no matter how hard he tried" - is described.  Luke TK-raping Jacen again while the latter isn't surprised just confirms that it's not a factor worth dwelling on.

Btw, your rationalisation isn't hard to grasp... Caedus fan, it just happens to be unsubstantiated by any logical facet of Force powers described in the lore.  Rather it's something you just made up to defend Jacen at the moment, with yourself the only person holding the interpretation true.  Somehow... you've conflated "charging up" power with expending power...  even though no sane person should confuse the two.  To the contrary - when a person is using their force reserves, they're usually not charging their force reserves.  Unless an exception is specified and they're doing both at the same time.  In this case, nothing's specified in regard to Luke "charging up" the power needed to spank Jacen again.  Luke messing with Jacen's ship via TK beforehand, isn't evidence of itself of that.  Which shouldn't a particular point difficult to grasp.

Relenting why Luke didn't TK Jacen when the latter was guarded by 8 YHV droids isn't of consequence either.  Trying to insist that Luke not doing something means he can't do something is a folly exercise.  I can just as easily assert that Luke didn't immediately one-shot all 8 YHV droids when they confronted himself, Saba and Ben.  In fact, I'd point out that they put up significant resistance.  This is in spite of top-tier feats spanning across his adventures.  Such as gesturing to disrupt the internal mechanisms of multiple droids; causing them to explode  Or overpower Unuthul, despite the latter being able to bend back turbo lasers without the Kilik Colony empowering him.  Yet Luke didn't one-shot every droid Jacen sent to kill the man, does that mean he can't?  What's more likely is that - as per the standard for him - he's holding back a vast proportion of his strength.  A premise that has plenty of in-universe statements and events to back up.

And in supplying further context, you've unearthed several more reasons to place Jacen very far below Luke Skywalker at his full [baseline] power.  

In fact, the feat that left him running on empty - as you pointed out - would legitimately put him below nearly every other person who specialised in Battle Meditation... including Lord Kaan.  Cementing the idea that Caedus being ~ to Aayla Secura, is the correct interpretation of him.  

To recap  - Caedus is "running on empty" after employing a force battle-link that empowered around a hundred of his commanders with rage :

And the effort to bring down the Fondorian defences involved him tricking "the Orbital team" controlling the defence to drop their shields.  So in other words, he's a pussy who's legitimately below every single Sith Lord who ever used power to influence non-force sensitives.  Exar Kun - for example - did freeze at least tens of thousands... possibly hundreds of thousands or more while waging a winning duel against Vodo.  Caedus is now demonstrably below him.

As for your claim that Caedus' exhaustion - after such a mid-tier feat - debunks the comparison.  I'd disagree.  It stands given that Luke was exerting no effort in pinning Caedus and his chair, and we should assume that he was doing the same when freezing his chair on its own. Yet Caedus couldn't make it budge despite all his efforts.  Jaina - on the other hand - did legitimately free Mitra of his Force Choke.

Given that Caedus in that state would have been killed by a single random Mandalorian (read: a lowly non-force sensitive) had the warrior not received orders to keep Jacen alive, I doubt he was employing a fraction of his power.

He's just that weak.  It's also important to note that the attackers were still pursuing him and Tahiri after his choke, so killing or incapacitating Mitra would have been pretty practical.  So there's no reason to assume he released his choke - to the contrary - Jaina freed her as noted by the text.

DC77 (Reborn) wrote:B) Jacen's utter astonishment at Luke's power and believing he's finally capped a limit on it.

Luke holding back doesn't hold up when we consider that in the very next book he goes to extreme lengths to capture Jacen, including wielding a level of power Jacen's never seen him use before, and no dramatic change in mindset between that event and this.

Frabrication by DarthCaedus77 wrote:
Tell me, did you actually read the book before writing out this, very splendid paragraph on the events that took place (I'll take the goalpost change to attacking this feat as a concession on the choke feat btw)? Jacen isn't exhausted after that initial effort, just mildly out of breath. No, it's the fact that he endures that while locating specific individuals on a planet with billions of inhabitants, that he isn't even on, that exhausts him (Which is above "pussy" tier). This argument is disingenuous at best, at worst entirely fabricated.

Star Wars LOTF Revelation wrote:
Caedus felt stronger now, but the raw energy of the battle link with his commanders, built up and discharged into the minds of the Fondorian shield technicians, hadn’t yet returned

Exhausted, he had to rely on the natural skill of the commanders who’d rallied to him. Two Fondorian frigates circled the Anakin Solo, pounding the shield generator dome.

Caedusfan wrote:Luke not doing something generally doesn't mean he can't, I agree.

CaedusFan wrote:
However in this particular instance, the logical move would be to do so, he has the time to do so and knows how big a threat Jacen is, yet doesn't. There's no reasonable explanation for this beyond inability. Luke holding back doesn't hold up when we consider that in the very next book he goes to extreme lengths to capture Jacen, including wielding a level of power Jacen's never seen him use before, and no dramatic change in mindset between that event and this. Luke seems to grasp the desperation of the situation and to be frank there's no reason for him to restrain himself.

Spoiler:

LOTF Fury wrote:Vexed, Luke tightened his jaw and nodded. He raised his voice. “Master Sebatyne: extract.“This one iz still— “Leaving.” Luke’s tone was unyielding. “Remember what we’re here for.”

o, being cheap shotted by a Mando after this event took place means he was going full throttle against a non force sensitive he wasn't even interested in killing? Are you serious?

I never claimed he released it, merely that he likely didn't attempt to stop Jaina from doing anything, given, not only is he exhausted and can't afford to waste energy on such an act but is also choking a lowly non force sensitive he has no interest in killing.