Re: Top 10 Sith and Jedi?

October 17th 2020, 5:07 pm

NotAA3 wrote:After discussions with my master and owner Ant on Discord, I've decided to kick Marr off, drop The Emperor's Wrath II down to 10, and place Malgus at 9 (tentative - both he and The Wrath could go higher). My list has been edited accordingly.

October 17th 2020, 5:49 pm

@Vaelias

immortality is stated as an impossibility for Valkorian

Yes, and it was for Krayt, too... that's why he died at the end of Legacy. Defeating death once, and being immortal aren't quite the same thing.

October 18th 2020, 5:00 pm

Depa Billaba and Lucien Draay are the only ones who matter

October 22nd 2020, 12:26 am

NotAA3 wrote:@Vaelias

immortality is stated as an impossibility for Valkorian

Yes, and it was for Krayt, too... that's why he died at the end of Legacy. Defeating death once, and being immortal aren't quite the same thing.

Fair enough, but Krayts way of coming back to life was far more impressive let’s be honest haha

October 22nd 2020, 1:01 am

Seturna wrote:Depa Billaba and Lucien Draay are the only ones who matter

Lol What’s your obsession with those guys hahahahaha

October 22nd 2020, 9:05 am

Vaelias wrote:

NotAA3 wrote:@Vaelias

immortality is stated as an impossibility for Valkorian

Yes, and it was for Krayt, too... that's why he died at the end of Legacy. Defeating death once, and being immortal aren't quite the same thing.

Fair enough, but Krayts way of coming back to life was far more impressive let’s be honest haha

I'm not sure it is, but I don't particularly care for debating it - I simply wanted to point out the obvious, that your comparison here was flawed.

October 22nd 2020, 12:26 pm Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)

Sith:
1. Sheev Palprotein
2. Knightfall Vader
3. Darth Plagueis
4. Darth Krayt
5. Darish Vol
6. Darth Caedus
7. Exar Kun
8. Dooku
9. Darth Tenebrous
10. Darth Airlock III

Jedi:
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Anakin Skywalker
3. Yoda
4. God Durron
5. Mace Windu
6. Obi-Wan
7. Revan/Outlander/Cade
8. Revan/Outlander/Cade
9. Revan/Outlander/Cade
10. Kyle Katarn

October 24th 2020, 9:41 am Message reputation : 100% (3 votes)

1. Sheev
2. Plagueis
3. Krayt
4. Vader
5. Tyranus
6. Valkorion

1. Luke
2. Jaina (I looked at the quote again and I haven't seen a valid reason to dispute it thus far)
3. Yoda
4. Anakin
5. Mace
6. Obi-Wan

Don't have a clear hierarchy beyond that.

October 24th 2020, 9:46 am

@master Azronger
What quote?

October 24th 2020, 10:02 am

@Sith Archivist Jaina being a combat equal of anyone in the Jedi Order.

October 24th 2020, 10:06 am

She's straight up admitted to being sub-Council members as of Invincible and I doubt she's had some enormous growth in power after the fact. As a matter of fact, I vividly remember her going through mental issues grounded in guilt for not believing her twin when she had the chance.

October 24th 2020, 2:39 pm

Master Azronger wrote:1. Sheev
2. Plagueis
3. Krayt
4. Vader
5. Tyranus
6. Valkorion

1. Luke
2. Jaina (I looked at the quote again and I haven't seen a valid reason to dispute it thus far)
3. Yoda
4. Anakin
5. Mace
6. Obi-Wan

Don't have a clear hierarchy beyond that.

Anakin is stated to be a nine along with Yoda and Sheev then he grows when he becomes Vader meaning that KFV > ROTS Sheev, also can I c that quote for Jaina pls

October 24th 2020, 2:43 pm Message reputation : 100% (2 votes)

New list revisited

Sith
1. Darth Sidious
2. Darth Vader
3. Darth Vitiate
4. Exar Kun
5. Darth Krayt
6. Darth Caedus
7. The Dreadmasters
8. DE Luke Skywalker
9. Darth Tyranus
10. Darish Vol

Jedi
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Yoda
3. Anakin Skywalker
4. Mace Windu
5. Kyp Durron
6. Saba Sebatyne
7. Revan
8. Count Dooku
9. Kyle Katarn
10. Satele Shan

October 24th 2020, 5:41 pm

Master Azronger wrote:1. Sheev
2. Plagueis
3. Krayt
4. Vader
5. Tyranus
6. Valkorion

1. Luke
2. Jaina (I looked at the quote again and I haven't seen a valid reason to dispute it thus far)
3. Yoda
4. Anakin
5. Mace
6. Obi-Wan

Don't have a clear hierarchy beyond that.

@Master Azronger: You think the FOTJ narrator is in-universe omniscient?

October 25th 2020, 12:54 am

@DarthAnt66 That's my default assumption unless it's made clear it's from a limited perspective. Regardless, it not being necessarily omniscient doesn't mean it's wrong.

October 25th 2020, 12:55 am

@Vaelias Anakin on the light side is an 8, inferior to Yoda and Sheev. He only becomes a 9 after joining the Sith. Even then, he's at most Palpatine's equal in power per Lucas.

October 25th 2020, 1:17 am

Master Azronger wrote:@Vaelias Anakin on the light side is an 8, inferior to Yoda and Sheev. He only becomes a 9 after joining the Sith. Even then, he's at most Palpatine's equal in power per Lucas.

The quote says “Anakin is a nine” if it meant Vader it would’ve said Vader
So seeing as Anakin was a nine and equal with Sheev and then he grows way stronger when he becomes Vader, doesn’t that make him above ROTS Palpatine

Or are there some quotes I’m missing if so can you provide them

October 25th 2020, 2:43 am

Master Azronger wrote:@DarthAnt66 That's my default assumption unless it's made clear it's from a limited perspective. Regardless, it not being necessarily omniscient doesn't mean it's wrong.

Is there a reason for that default assumption?

Star Wars novel narrators are far more likely to be limited than omniscient on average, and burden of proof should go to the more intense claim (narrator saying something that may be true versus narrator saying something that is absolutely true), so I would say it makes more sense for in-universe limited to be the default.

October 25th 2020, 3:33 am

Shimrra wrote:Sith:
1. Sheev Palprotein
2. Knightfall Vader
3. Darth Plagueis
4. Darth Krayt
5. Darish Vol
6. Darth Caedus
7. Exar Kun
8. Dooku
9. Darth Tenebrous
10. Darth Airlock III

Jedi:
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Anakin Skywalker
3. Yoda
4. God Durron
5. Mace Windu
6. Obi-Wan
7. Revan/Outlander/Cade
8. Revan/Outlander/Cade
9. Revan/Outlander/Cade
10. Kyle Katarn

What’s your reasoning for having Anakin above Yoda ?

October 25th 2020, 4:26 am

Vaelias wrote:

Master Azronger wrote:@Vaelias Anakin on the light side is an 8, inferior to Yoda and Sheev. He only becomes a 9 after joining the Sith. Even then, he's at most Palpatine's equal in power per Lucas.

The quote says “Anakin is a nine” if it meant Vader it would’ve said Vader
So seeing as Anakin was a nine and equal with Sheev and then he grows way stronger when he becomes Vader, doesn’t that make him above ROTS Palpatine

Or are there some quotes I’m missing if so can you provide them

Anakin and Vader are the same person. Perhaps if there were no other statements clarifying this for us, you might get by on that technicality, but it's clearly been stated Anakin was an 8 at the start of ROTS and only becomes a 9 upon embracing the dark side. Even when he's Vader, he's still being referred to as Anakin.

Lucas then clarified that Mustafar Vader - who was stronger than ever - is only at best on par with ROTS Sheev in power, so light side Anakin would evidently be weaker.

Top 10 Sith and Jedi? - Page 7 Maul_could_have_surpassed_Sidious

Top 10 Sith and Jedi? - Page 7 Maul_could_have_surpassed_Sidious

October 25th 2020, 5:48 am

Master Azronger wrote:

Vaelias wrote:

Master Azronger wrote:@Vaelias Anakin on the light side is an 8, inferior to Yoda and Sheev. He only becomes a 9 after joining the Sith. Even then, he's at most Palpatine's equal in power per Lucas.

The quote says “Anakin is a nine” if it meant Vader it would’ve said Vader
So seeing as Anakin was a nine and equal with Sheev and then he grows way stronger when he becomes Vader, doesn’t that make him above ROTS Palpatine

Or are there some quotes I’m missing if so can you provide them

Anakin and Vader are the same person. Perhaps if there were no other statements clarifying this for us, you might get by on that technicality, but it's clearly been stated Anakin was an 8 at the start of ROTS and only becomes a 9 upon embracing the dark side. Even when he's Vader, he's still being referred to as Anakin.

Lucas then clarified that Mustafar Vader - who was stronger than ever - is only at best on par with ROTS Sheev in power, so light side Anakin would evidently be weaker.

Ahhh ok yeh that makes sense, give pre suit Anakin 48 more hours an he’d be > Sheev tho hahaha

October 27th 2020, 1:19 am

Master Azronger wrote:1. Sheev
2. Plagueis
3. Krayt
4. Vader
5. Tyranus
6. Valkorion

1. Luke
2. Jaina (I looked at the quote again and I haven't seen a valid reason to dispute it thus far)
3. Yoda
4. Anakin
5. Mace
6. Obi-Wan

Don't have a clear hierarchy beyond that.

How can you have Plagueis above Vader when Plageuis is at best on par with TPM Sidious and Vader is stated to be be equal to ROTS Sidious

October 27th 2020, 6:50 am

Midi-chlorian manipulation allows him to punch above his weight.

December 27th 2020, 4:49 am

My list has changed a lot since last time lol
Sith:
1. Darth Sidious
2. Sarasu Taalon (post-pool)
3. Darish Vol
4. Exar Kun (post-ritual)
5. Darth Caedus
6. KF Vader
7. Darth Plagueis
8. Darth Malgus (Onslaught)
9. Vitiate (Act III)
10. Darth Tyranus
Jedi (this one is a lot harder so it may not be the best list):
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Revan (EoO)
3. Hero of Tython
4. Kyp Durron
5. Yoda
6. Mace Windu
7. Anakin Skywalker
8. Barsen’thor
9. Obi Wan Kenobi
10. Satele Shan

December 27th 2020, 9:17 am

1.Darth Jadus
2. Tulak Hord
3. Aloysius Kallig
4. Marka Ragnos
5. Naga Sadow
6. Ludo Kressh
7. Darth Marr
8. Darth Nox
9. Terrak Morhage
10. Darth Mortis

1. Gnost Dural
2. HoT
3. Satele
4. Barsen
5. ancient consular
6. Jedi revan
7. Meetra Surik
8. Luke Skywalker
9. Jaina
10. Jacen