Count Dooku Vs. Darth Caedus

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HeartoftheForce wrote:Dooku ragdolls in a mismatch

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:Dooku ragdolls in a mismatch

Like he did against Anakin?

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:Dooku ragdolls in a mismatch

Like he did against Anakin?

I don’t think Caedus could block a single swing from Anakin

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:Dooku ragdolls in a mismatch

Like he did against Anakin?

I don’t think Caedus could block a single swing from Anakin

Why not?

He came down on a beverage table, smashing it apart, then Sing was over him, her crimson blade arcing down.

Jacen whipped his lightsaber around to block, catching her blade about halfway up the shaft and filling the air with a sizzling shower of sparks. Sing grabbed her hilt with both hands and began to push, slowly driving the tip of her lightsaber down toward his eye.

The glow was as blinding as the heat was searing, and Jacen's vision blossomed into a fiery red blur. He brought his free hand up to brace his weapon arm and tried not to worry about whether his eyeball would melt, not daring to turn his head or even look away for fear that he would slip.

- Tempest

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:Dooku ragdolls in a mismatch

Like he did against Anakin?

I don’t think Caedus could block a single swing from Anakin

Why not?

Because despite being amped by fear, rage and love for his daughter he was getting overpowered by an "ageing" ( reaching the end of useful life; obsolescent) Aurra Sing?

He came down on a beverage table, smashing it apart, then Sing was over him, her crimson blade arcing down.

Jacen whipped his lightsaber around to block, catching her blade about halfway up the shaft and filling the air with a sizzling shower of sparks. Sing grabbed her hilt with both hands and began to push, slowly driving the tip of her lightsaber down toward his eye.

The glow was as blinding as the heat was searing, and Jacen's vision blossomed into a fiery red blur. He brought his free hand up to brace his weapon arm and tried not to worry about whether his eyeball would melt, not daring to turn his head or even look away for fear that he would slip.

- Tempest

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:Dooku ragdolls in a mismatch

Like he did against Anakin?

I don’t think Caedus could block a single swing from Anakin

Why not?

Because despite being amped by fear, rage and love for his daughter he was getting overpowered by an "ageing" ( reaching the end of useful life; obsolescent) Aurra Sing?

He came down on a beverage table, smashing it apart, then Sing was over him, her crimson blade arcing down.

Jacen whipped his lightsaber around to block, catching her blade about halfway up the shaft and filling the air with a sizzling shower of sparks. Sing grabbed her hilt with both hands and began to push, slowly driving the tip of her lightsaber down toward his eye.

The glow was as blinding as the heat was searing, and Jacen's vision blossomed into a fiery red blur. He brought his free hand up to brace his weapon arm and tried not to worry about whether his eyeball would melt, not daring to turn his head or even look away for fear that he would slip.

- Tempest

Actually, he was winning. 

"Jacen did not reply. Sing was still struggling to free herself of his domination, and all his concentration was focused on keeping the pressure on until he drew close enough to strike."

Source: Legacy of the Force: Tempest

And that's Jacen Solo. We know he became much more powerful than ever when he turned to the dark side.

Wait.
 
Jacen spoke the word with his mind instead of his mouth. At the same time, he was expanding his Force presence into Sing's mind, opening himself fully to the Force and using its power to push himself deeper into her mind, to crush her own presence and force it deep down into the bottom of her being.
 
"Wait," he repeated.
 
Sing fought back, trying to push him from her mind, but Jacen had taken her by surprise. He had the power of his anger and his fear and his hatred behind him, and she simply was not strong enough.
 
.....
 
Sing stood with her back to Jacen, about five paces beyond the droid, on the other side of a smoldering couch. In one hand, she held her still-ignited fightsaber. In the other was a class-C thermal detonator with a disintegration radius large enough to kill herself, Jacen, Allana, and probably half the personnel on the decks directly above and below.
 
As Jacen started toward her, she looked over her shoulder with an expression in her pale eyes that seemed equal parts hatred and awe.
 
"Don't ever touch me like that again."
 
Jacen did not reply. Sing was still struggling to free herself of his domination, and all his concentration was focused on keeping the pressure on until he drew close enough to strike.
 
Sing flashed him a cold smile. "But then, I don't think you'll have the chance."
 
Her thumb twitched.
 
The activation light on the thermal detonator began to blink, and that was enough to shatter Jacen's concentration. 

- Tempest

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:

The Rich Man wrote:

HeartoftheForce wrote:Dooku ragdolls in a mismatch

Like he did against Anakin?

I don’t think Caedus could block a single swing from Anakin

Why not?

Because despite being amped by fear, rage and love for his daughter he was getting overpowered by an "ageing" ( reaching the end of useful life; obsolescent) Aurra Sing?

He came down on a beverage table, smashing it apart, then Sing was over him, her crimson blade arcing down.

Jacen whipped his lightsaber around to block, catching her blade about halfway up the shaft and filling the air with a sizzling shower of sparks. Sing grabbed her hilt with both hands and began to push, slowly driving the tip of her lightsaber down toward his eye.

The glow was as blinding as the heat was searing, and Jacen's vision blossomed into a fiery red blur. He brought his free hand up to brace his weapon arm and tried not to worry about whether his eyeball would melt, not daring to turn his head or even look away for fear that he would slip.

- Tempest

Actually, he was winning. 

"Jacen did not reply. Sing was still struggling to free herself of his domination, and all his concentration was focused on keeping the pressure on until he drew close enough to strike."

Source: Legacy of the Force: Tempest

And that's Jacen Solo. We know he became much more powerful than ever when he turned to the dark side.

Wait.
 
Jacen spoke the word with his mind instead of his mouth. At the same time, he was expanding his Force presence into Sing's mind, opening himself fully to the Force and using its power to push himself deeper into her mind, to crush her own presence and force it deep down into the bottom of her being.
 
"Wait," he repeated.
 
Sing fought back, trying to push him from her mind, but Jacen had taken her by surprise. He had the power of his anger and his fear and his hatred behind him, and she simply was not strong enough.
 
.....
 
Sing stood with her back to Jacen, about five paces beyond the droid, on the other side of a smoldering couch. In one hand, she held her still-ignited fightsaber. In the other was a class-C thermal detonator with a disintegration radius large enough to kill herself, Jacen, Allana, and probably half the personnel on the decks directly above and below.
 
As Jacen started toward her, she looked over her shoulder with an expression in her pale eyes that seemed equal parts hatred and awe.
 
"Don't ever touch me like that again."
 
Jacen did not reply. Sing was still struggling to free herself of his domination, and all his concentration was focused on keeping the pressure on until he drew close enough to strike.
 
Sing flashed him a cold smile. "But then, I don't think you'll have the chance."
 
Her thumb twitched.
 
The activation light on the thermal detonator began to blink, and that was enough to shatter Jacen's concentration. 

- Tempest

[size=32]So let's take stock.[/size]

[size=32]Jacen opens himself fully to the Dark Side. Drawing on his fear for Allana, anger and hate. He is at full power. This is inarguable.[/size]

[size=32]Despite [/size][size=32]taking Sing by surprise it is still taking all his concentration to hold her in place. He cannot ragdoll her or blast her or anything of the like. He has to slowly approach with his full power holding her down to strike.[/size]

[size=32]Even then [/size][size=32]Sing [/size][size=32]breaks out of his hold [/size][size=32]and triggers the detonator. The text then notes that even the tiniest flash of the detonator is enough to shatter Caedus' concentration.[/size]

[size=32]Caedus absolutely [/size][size=32]did [/size][size=32]use his full power + an emotional amp + the element of surprise on Aurra. Even then it took all he had to [/size][size=32]hold her [/size][size=32]he couldn't [/size][size=32]attack her [/size][size=32]and she [/size]broke free.[size=32] And yes she did break free hence the smile and being able to trigger the detonator despite Jacens command. The distraction is not what freed her. [/size]


[size=32]And no Jacen doesn't grow to any meaningful degree past this point. [/size]

LadyKulvax wrote:Isn't he outright stated to be growing more powerful every day?

Also, as far as I know the only person who can even genuinely overpower him by Invincible is Luke. Everyone else is incapable.

Seturna wrote:Dooku wins.

Isn't he outright stated to be growing more powerful every day?

It's referring to his current power.

And Jacen reached his full potential when he became sith lord.

Actually, Jacen was winning. Aurra just found his opening and triggered a detonator.

The Rich Man wrote:

Seturna wrote:Dooku wins.

Why?

HeartoftheForce wrote:

Isn't he outright stated to be growing more powerful every day?

Which amounts to? Oh right losing to Mara, losing to Katarn after that whose inferior to Mara, coming off poorly in a power comparison with base Jaina whose inferior to both, yeah you get it.

It's referring to his current power.

[size=32]His current power is all he has at his disposal + an amp from needing to save Alanna. Prove his "prime" power exceeds that.[/size]

And Jacen reached his full potential when he became sith lord.

[size=32]Jacen never reached anything close to his full potential. [/size]

Actually, Jacen was winning. Aurra just found his opening and triggered a detonator.

[size=32]That would be a no.[/size]

Losing to Mara? Lol, no. Note that she had some advantages over him. That's why her performance was that good.

Jacen was on the knife-edge between dying and killing. They grappled, Force-pushed, Force-crushed: he threw her back again, trying to Force-jolt her spine and paralyze her for a moment, but somehow she deflected it and bricks flew out of the wall as if someone had punched them through from the other side. She almost Force-snatched the lightsaber from his hand

- LotF Sacrifice

She also said Jacen was way beyond her

As for Katarn, Caedus got severely injured while he was fighting Luke.

So when Niathal said he did not look well, she was correct. He keenly felt his worst injury. Not the vibroblade wound, not the scalp tear, not the kidney damage-all three were healing. All three were the kind of pain that strengthened him.

-LotF Fury

Katarn still needed a strike team to fight Caedus.

Three Jedi Knights: the younger Horn, the Falleen Mithric, the Bothan Hu'lya. He resisted the urge to snort. Separately or collectively, these Jedi Knights were no match for him.
Katarn, though, was a threat.

And Caedus nearly killed him.

Jaina grasped it in the Force and drew it, stumbling, into Caedus's flank. The droid was more than heavy enough to send Caedus staggering.

- Invincible 

"I know that you Masters - and several Jedi Knights - are more skilled in both Force and lightsaber than I am.



- Invincible 

Dark side amp is greater than rage amp. For example, Anakin had became more powerful than ever when he turned to the dark side. Rage amp doesn't amplify you as much as dark side amp does. 

His performance against Luke is definitely better than his performance against Aurra.

Aurra just found his opening and triggered a detonator.

losing to Mara,

losing to Katarn

Katarn and Horn were taxed, not Caedus. The wording makes that quite clear.

Yeah no, in any school of writing, the use of the -- seperates Jacen altogether. It's clearly Katarn and Valin Horn.