ESB Vader vs ESB Yoda

Yoda gets tired of waiting to train Luke, so he builds a new lightsaber and sets out to fight the Sith. Is the weakened Grand Master strong enough to overcome Vader?

Isn't there a quote that says only Yoda can beat the Emperor as of ANH or ESB or something?

Vader wins

Vader beats ROTJ Yoda per Lucas. Probably loses to ESB though.

ESB Yoda needed his full power to lift the X-wing. And it wasn't even a combat situation, where he'd have less time to focus his power. I don't see why Vader doesn't destroy his ass.

vader gg

Never thought I'd say this, but Vader honestly ragdolls.

@Azronger: I’ve seen some quotes say he did it easily, though I’m not sure which camp the majority of sources back.

Honestly Vader. The Lucas quote and Yoda struggling to lift a ship out of the swamp are enough evidence. With conflicting sources, the film is the highest authority.

Cool. That was always my take as well, but I was curious to see where the community landed.

Yoda's only chance to win is TP.

HellfireUnit wrote:Yoda's only chance to win is TP.

Funny enough, we saw this in an Infinities comic (I know, I know, non-canon). In it, Vader fought through the TP and killed Yoda.

Yeah, I was referring to it.

Vader probably wins.

where does lucas even say that?

DarthAnt66 wrote:Vader beats ROTJ Yoda per Lucas. Probably loses to ESB though.

How can you come to that conclusion? If Vader beats ROTJ Yoda than it's almost certain he can beat ESB Yoda too. Especially since there is no implication of any power differencial between ESB and ROTJ Yoda apart from the fact he is dying in ROTJ.
OT- Vader wins handily.

I'm gonna piss a lot of people off with this statement but I can debate it if you like, ESB Yoda is prime Yoda

Isv wrote:I'm gonna piss a lot of people off with this statement but I can debate it if you like, ESB Yoda is prime Yoda

u ever heard of sepuku? cuz u might just be committing it right now

DarthAnt66 wrote:@Azronger: I’ve seen some quotes say he did it easily, though I’m not sure which camp the majority of sources back.

I've seen quotes both ways too, but Luke and therefore the primary source material (the story itself) support the thesis that Yoda struggled with the X-wing.

Isv wrote:I'm gonna piss a lot of people off with this statement but I can debate it if you like, ESB Yoda is prime Yoda

I'm genuinely curious what your reasoning for that claim is. I'd love to hear your rationale

DarthAnt66 wrote:Vader beats ROTJ Yoda per Lucas. Probably loses to ESB though.

When did Lucas say that? And you do realize that RotJ Yoda was sick right?

Underachiever599 wrote:

Isv wrote:I'm gonna piss a lot of people off with this statement but I can debate it if you like, ESB Yoda is prime Yoda

I'm genuinely curious what your reasoning for that claim is. I'd love to hear your rationale

Okay so just a short case here, but I think it might change a few minds.

meet super Yoda also known as Prime Yoda or ESB Yoda:



Addressing misconceptions:


Most people use this quote or quotes like it to say that Yoda weakened post ROTS:



Yet, all this says is that Yoda has slowed and his spirit is broken. However, this could just refer to his physicals and as we have seen many times, as force users grow older they grow more powerful regardless of the restrictions of the vessel they are in case and point Darth Sidious, he is over 70 years old by ROTJ and his body is literally eaten away from the degradation he suffers yet he is still as powerful or more powerful than ever. In fact, if anything due to the nature of the lightside and Dark Yoda would be better off than Sheev because the lightside is not known to have any negative repercussions on the body. All of this aside it's entirely possible to physically decline and grow in the force. On top of the aforementioned reasons for this quote not really saying anything of note about Yoda deteriorating, the quote comes from a source Pablo Hidalgo has publicly shamed as not something he agrees with. Not the best supporting evidence for an anti Yoda case.

New Quotes:


So the other thing is that Yoda is not exactly "broken" as the quote would lead you to believe, he has actually been training patiently waiting for the day that he can take on Sidious again and studying the nature of the force for twenty years. In fact all Jedi of this era are stated to Hone (perfect) their skills:





Additionally, we know that Yoda was approximately just as powerful as he was when he was a Jedi leader and Battle commander:




Each of these quotes says he has the same strength in the force OR the same unparalleled skills he had as Grandmaster. All this evidence combined makes me think that Yoda is actually more powerful in ESB and the OT era than ROTS, he has had 20 years to "hone his skills", "study the force", and "patiently awaiting the day to topple the Sith." By all reason and supported by multiple quotes Yoda is at the very least just as powerful as he was in ROTS and wouldn't let his skills go to waste if he was planning on confronting sidious again.

That's pretty much it, thanks for coming to my Ted Talk

@Isv: Very compelling case, I'm surprised no one has argued for this sooner.