Plagueis runs the Mini-Tenebrae Gauntlet

CuckedCurry wrote:

WalkingInCircles wrote:

CuckedCurry wrote:

WalkingInCircles wrote:

CuckedCurry wrote:Clears

How does he beat Valkorion?

Because he’s conventionally more powerful, which is more relevant in a close quarter fight than any estoteric shit. Even if it did get kinky, Plagueis whips out the MM and gradually wills him to die.

Not seeing how he's conventionally more powerful. A massively weakened Valk could kill hundreds of people and destroy countless vehicles with lightning, drain entire planets, and one-shot the Outlander, unchained Vaylin and Arcann.

Plagueis near-atomised Maladians whilst near dead and vastly pre prime. Everything Valk can do Plagueis can do better

Like levelling the Dark Temple whilst dying and also vastly pre-prime and heavily weakened? Or draining Ziost while vastly pre-prime and disintegrating countless numbers of people in seconds?  

I think you have that sentence mixed up.

Feat 1 isn’t even remotely the same as Plagueis was legit near dead and was sending these death waves out on the fly. Give Plagueis a few seconds to gather his power and he replicates that feat. Feat 2 was done with extensive prep, again not even remotely relevant. You’re bringing up these feats like Plagueis couldn’t replicate them, when lesser Sith like apprentice Bane has replicated 1 of the feats you listed.

Feat 1 isn’t even remotely the same as Plagueis was legit near dead and was sending these death waves out on the fly.

Vitiate was "legit" on the brink of death and had been massively weakened by his previous Voice's death, the destruction of the First Son, and the HoT disrupting his ritual to the point that he was considerably below act 3 HoT. 

Give Plagueis a few seconds to gather his power and he replicates that feat.

Technically, Vitiate wasn't noted to be gathering his power until he actually started shaking the Dark Temple, so...

Feat 2 was done with extensive prep, again not even remotely relevant.

...The prep to restore his strength, you mean? The process was done without a ritual, so it wasn't with "extensive prep". The "prep" you refer to was purely in order to restore some of his strength.

You’re bringing up these feats like Plagueis couldn’t replicate them, when lesser Sith like apprentice Bane has replicated 1 of the feats you listed.

And you're acting like Valkorion couldn't replicate the disintegration feat, lol. Again, he's killed hundreds of people while not even focusing on them and while weakened to Arcann level as opposed to when he used to be able to one-shot Arcann with ease. Disintegrating a few enemies really shouldn't be that much of a step up.

WalkingInCircles wrote:

Feat 1 isn’t even remotely the same as Plagueis was legit near dead and was sending these death waves out on the fly.

Vitiate was "legit" on the brink of death and had been massively weakened by his previous Voice's death, the destruction of the First Son, and the HoT disrupting his ritual to the point that he was considerably below act 3 HoT. 

Give Plagueis a few seconds to gather his power and he replicates that feat.

Technically, Vitiate wasn't noted to be gathering his power until he actually started shaking the Dark Temple, so...

Feat 2 was done with extensive prep, again not even remotely relevant.

...The prep to restore his strength, you mean? The process was done without a ritual, so it wasn't with "extensive prep". The "prep" you refer to was purely in order to restore some of his strength.

You’re bringing up these feats like Plagueis couldn’t replicate them, when lesser Sith like apprentice Bane has replicated 1 of the feats you listed.

And you're acting like Valkorion couldn't replicate the disintegration feat, lol. Again, he's killed hundreds of people while not even focusing on them and while weakened to Arcann level as opposed to when he used to be able to one-shot Arcann with ease. Disintegrating a few enemies really shouldn't be that much of a step up.

He just wasn’t though, was he? Was he gushing with blood and having his heart failing? Didn’t think so. Once again, not really comparable. Whether or not Vitiate was stated to have drawn deeply on his power isn’t relevant, because to accomplish such a feat he would have needed to draw exstensively on his power. Plagueis could easily replicate, if not outright surpass, this feat based on his scaling over Bane. Try again 

A death wave is not applicable on the fly and is not relevant in a 1v1 discussion. If it was he wouldn’t be shit scared of Vaylin. The feat was accomplished with time on his side. Plagueis could replicate this showing and outright put it to sleep, when you consider his utter mastery of life and death itself. 

Now, I ask again, who has replicated Plagueis’ Fobosi massacre without drawing heavily on their reserves or doing it in oneness? Certainly not Revan, Vitiate’s close contender.

He just wasn’t though, was he? Was he gushing with blood and having his heart failing? Didn’t think so.

Good point. He totally


wasn't at all


injured 



in the slightest.

Once again, not really comparable. Whether or not Vitiate was stated to have drawn deeply on his power isn’t relevant, because to accomplish such a feat he would have needed to draw exstensively on his power.

So you concede that Vitiate could draw upon huge levels of power equivalent to that which levelled the Dark Temple virtually at will.

Plagueis could easily replicate, if not outright surpass, this feat based on his scaling over Bane. Try again 

Bane broke the ancient walls of the atrium and caused a chain reaction that led to the Temple collapsing on itself while essentially fully rested (feel free to correct me on this). Vitiate while on the brink of death released enough power to shake the Dark Temple to the point that it began to collapse and tear itself apart. 

A death wave is not applicable on the fly and is not relevant in a 1v1 discussion. If it was he wouldn’t be shit scared of Vaylin.

Yes, because Valkorion is going to wipe out an entire planet to kill a single being. And he was scared of Vaylin before Ziost, btw. 

The feat was accomplished with time on his side.

Yeah, when time allowed him to restore enough of his strength to do it:

"On Ziost his spirit controls beings and then uses to kill other beings then posses more, it's a cycle until I think it reaches a point where he's able to consume the planet."
- Charles Boyd.

Plagueis could replicate this showing and outright put it to sleep, when you consider his utter mastery of life and death itself. 

Does he have any comparable drain showings or indications that he could drain an entire planet in seconds?

Now, I ask again, who has replicated Plagueis’ Fobosi massacre without drawing heavily on their reserves or doing it in oneness? Certainly not Revan, Vitiate’s close contender.

Thought I should mention, he didn't actually disintegrate them:

In blinding motion his hands and feet smashed skulls and windpipes. He stopped once to conjure a Force wave that all but atomized the bodies of six Maladians. He spun through a turn, dragging the wave halfway around the room to kill half a dozen more.

@WalkingInCircles

while essentially fully rested

This is just outright false. It's noted in the novel Bane is exhausted from his battle with Kas'im.

Plus, he was massively pre-prime.

WalkingInCircles wrote:

He just wasn’t though, was he? Was he gushing with blood and having his heart failing? Didn’t think so.

Good point. He totally


wasn't at all


injured 



in the slightest.

Once again, not really comparable. Whether or not Vitiate was stated to have drawn deeply on his power isn’t relevant, because to accomplish such a feat he would have needed to draw exstensively on his power.

So you concede that Vitiate could draw upon huge levels of power equivalent to that which levelled the Dark Temple virtually at will.

Plagueis could easily replicate, if not outright surpass, this feat based on his scaling over Bane. Try again 

Bane broke the ancient walls of the atrium and caused a chain reaction that led to the Temple collapsing on itself while essentially fully rested (feel free to correct me on this). Vitiate while on the brink of death released enough power to shake the Dark Temple to the point that it began to collapse and tear itself apart. 

A death wave is not applicable on the fly and is not relevant in a 1v1 discussion. If it was he wouldn’t be shit scared of Vaylin.

Yes, because Valkorion is going to wipe out an entire planet to kill a single being. And he was scared of Vaylin before Ziost, btw. 

The feat was accomplished with time on his side.

Yeah, when time allowed him to restore enough of his strength to do it:

"On Ziost his spirit controls beings and then uses to kill other beings then posses more, it's a cycle until I think it reaches a point where he's able to consume the planet."
- Charles Boyd.

Plagueis could replicate this showing and outright put it to sleep, when you consider his utter mastery of life and death itself. 

Does he have any comparable drain showings or indications that he could drain an entire planet in seconds?

Now, I ask again, who has replicated Plagueis’ Fobosi massacre without drawing heavily on their reserves or doing it in oneness? Certainly not Revan, Vitiate’s close contender.

Thought I should mention, he didn't actually disintegrate them:

In blinding motion his hands and feet smashed skulls and windpipes. He stopped once to conjure a Force wave that all but atomized the bodies of six Maladians. He spun through a turn, dragging the wave halfway around the room to kill half a dozen more.

Bro you’re walking in circles. The injury is not remotely comparable because Vitiate used his force barrier to cushion the blows. Plagueis was missing a chunk of his neck, holding the blood in, keeping himself alive, and half-assedly obliterating Maladians at the same time. I’m not exactly breaking dawn mate.

I’m not sure why you brought up drain, seeing how Plagueis’ mastery over life and death goes beyond Force drain. Why would he dedicate time to learning a power that is fundamentally inferior to his own mastery? Plagueis could achieve so much more than that on a much larger scale. Moving on

Meanwhile POD Bane has Vitiate matched with the temple feat, so don’t disagrace Plagueis’ name like that my child

ONTOP OF THAT. Vitiate was amplified by draining our lord and savior Revan for so many years and thus since he basically had THE FORCE ITSELF to draw on, he wouldn't be hurt by some measly pillars

This depends how small Valk actually gets tbh. I know his power would stay the same, but it would only stay the same in relation to his own body. So if he say is only planetary at full size then logic would dictate his area of effect at half size would be half a planet in scale.

So based off what I remember from toys, and based off a fucking realistic Dooku doll I saw, I think we can use those as proxies for how his size would effect him power. I'll use the MARR bolt as a general indicator for the size of his blast here as well:



I'd say around 6 feet would be a good start here to make sense of this. IE if all the mini-Valks here are 1/2 size then the same effort would yield a 3 foot wide lightning bolt at Plagueis as opposed to an all encompassing blast.
I think that Dooku doll was like 12 inches, so if Valk is 12 inches and his normal height is 6 feet, then that would be 1/6th of its normal potency; or rather a foot wide beam aimed at Plagueis. If we go by the old SW toys and not sure if they still make them, but they were like 4 inches, which would be an 18th of its full sized potency. A 4 inch blast wouldn't have the same damaging effects at the same power level and exertion as a 6 foot wide blast. I don't know how tall Lego are but it'd be just a Lego sized lightning bolt coming at him.

That's not to say what he hit Marr with was his max, but it illustrates the point nicely I feel. He would have to exert himself massively to hit the same potency as his full-sized self at lesser sizes. It'd be the same concept if you woke up tomorrow and everything was double the size. Suddenly that sick 15 pound dumbbell you've been curling with everynight would be double in weight relative to you and you'd just snap all your tendons in your 7 inch arm trying to curl it.

I don't think even the biggest Valk fans would argue that a Lego sized Valk at diminished capacity could beat Plagueis. Maybe not even at midget sized capacity, so I doubt he wins any rounds here. Good idea for a thread though.

Unfunny 0/10 Don’t worry you can kiss my feet later

This is just outright false. It's noted in the novel Bane is exhausted from his battle with Kas'im.

Thank goodness someone called me out on this. It's not like I asked Curry to correct me if I was wrong as I haven't read the novel in its entirety.

Someone’s a salty gamer