Amped Jaina Solo runs the guantlet

September 6th 2019, 5:13 pm

The Jaina Solo that is amped by Luke:

"Despite the ringing in her ears and the gauze in her head-despite her hugely aching skull and the big knot of hurt swelling on her brow-Jaina had never been so filled with the Force. She could feel it in every cell of her body, swirling through her like fire, burning more ferociously every moment. She had never felt so strong or so quick or so alert. She could drive her fist through a durasteel wall, or catch a blaster bolt between her fingers. Despite the red curtain of blood cascading from the gash where Vatok's helmet had split her forehead, she was aware of everything."

Same starting positions and location as Anakin vs. Obi Wan in RotS. Full knowledge and recovery.

1. Darth Thanaton
2. Darth Bane
3. Exar Kun
4. Dooku
5. Vaylin
6. Darth Krayt
7. Darth Plagueis
8. RotS Sidious
9. TUF Luke

September 6th 2019, 7:06 pm

At least till Vaylin.

September 6th 2019, 7:13 pm

Dies at 4.

September 6th 2019, 7:30 pm

Thanaton

September 6th 2019, 7:55 pm

Caedus believed he was fighting Luke and didn't think he was abnormally weak, so this amped Jaina is probably comparable to the Luke that fought Jacen on the Anakin Solo.

September 6th 2019, 10:33 pm Message reputation : 100% (1 vote)

Probably 4

September 6th 2019, 11:11 pm

Greysentinel365 wrote:Probably 4

There's no way Dooku ~ Inferno-fight Luke.

September 6th 2019, 11:26 pm

6.

Dooku gets clowned.

September 7th 2019, 12:24 am

The Ellimist wrote:

Greysentinel365 wrote:Probably 4

There's no way Dooku ~ Inferno-fight Luke

Neither is this iteration of Jaina.

September 7th 2019, 12:29 am

Greysentinel365 wrote:

The Ellimist wrote:

Greysentinel365 wrote:Probably 4

There's no way Dooku ~ Inferno-fight Luke

Neither is this iteration of Jaina.

Caedus bought that it was Luke.

September 7th 2019, 12:43 am

NotAA3 wrote:Dies at 4.

September 7th 2019, 12:43 am

dark_globe wrote:

NotAA3 wrote:Dies at 4.

You think when Caedus thought he was fighting Luke, he was really fighting a < Dooku tier combatant?

September 7th 2019, 12:45 am

The Ellimist wrote:

Greysentinel365 wrote:

The Ellimist wrote:

Greysentinel365 wrote:Probably 4

There's no way Dooku ~ Inferno-fight Luke

Neither is this iteration of Jaina.

Caedus bought that it was Luke.

And? Caedus doesn't sense anything, the moment he see's Luke's face he just goes into full panic mode.

I'd also like to note that, as I'm sure you are aware that Luke vastly outstrips every other Jedi of the era. Yet Caedus didn't have a moment of "only one person could move this fast" or anything of the like. He didn't think it was Luke until he saw his face.

Even then Jaina fought a Caedus in much worse shape than the one Luke wrecked

The last time he had fought Luke, he had started with a painful kidney wound but two good arms-and barely managed to survive. Now, with a relatively bearable shoulder wound and a single good arm, he had to do more than survive,

- Invincible

September 7th 2019, 12:53 am

Greysentinel365 wrote:And? Caedus doesn't sense anything, the moment he see's Luke's face he just goes into full panic mode.

Actually, he was noting that the person in question was really good before he saw Luke's face, and even before he did he was barely able to defend against Jaina's attacks and couldn't even stagger her with a body shot. He also saw Luke's face like seconds into the actual duel.

Then, throughout the duel, he was on the retreat and getting his ass kicked, only managing to survive because of environmental factors and seemingly outwitting Jaina.

Even then Jaina fought a Caedus in much worse shape than the one Luke wrecked

That doesn't change the fact that Caedus described not-Luke's style as brutal rather than "wow, he's massively weaker than I expected", and Jaina basically felt like she was a semi-omniscient Superman.

The entire point of Luke's schtick was to make it look like it was him instead of Jaina, and amping her so that she could beat her brother. Are you saying Luke was incapable of amping Jaina to a level beyond Dooku?

September 7th 2019, 1:11 am

There's a difference between "oh this person is good" and "oh f@ck it's Luke".

Then, throughout the duel, he was on the retreat and getting his ass kicked, only managing to survive because of environmental factors and seemingly outwitting Jaina.

But not like he was with Luke. With Luke, despite Caedus constantly getting stronger and Luke getting weaker via injuries, Luke still consistently bashed through Jacen's guard with 1-3 slashes. And even when Luke was at his weakest and Caedus was at his strongest, Luke could still just ragdoll him. Jaina shows no such ability here.

Now, with nearly no injuries to amp him and only one good arm, Caedus is consistently blocking Jaina's attacks. Likewise Jaina only got her killshot because Caedus expected Luke to react in one way, only for Jaina to react another.

The entire point of Luke's schtick was to make it look like it was him instead of Jaina, and amping her so that she could beat her brother. Are you saying Luke was incapable of amping Jaina to a level beyond Dooku?

You can only amp a person as much as their body allows. It's not so much a case of Luke not being able to as him not wanting to Dorsk 81 her.

September 7th 2019, 1:23 am

Stops at Dooku

September 7th 2019, 6:47 am

MasterCilghal wrote:Stops at Dooku

September 8th 2019, 1:50 am

Greysentinel365 wrote:There's a difference between "oh this person is good" and "oh f@ck it's Luke".

He was losing to this Jaina even before he saw that it was Luke, and even on reflection after the fight he never noted that Luke seemed particularly weak.

But not like he was with Luke. With Luke, despite Caedus constantly getting stronger and Luke getting weaker via injuries, Luke still consistently bashed through Jacen's guard with 1-3 slashes. And even when Luke was at his weakest and Caedus was at his strongest, Luke could still just ragdoll him. Jaina shows no such ability here.

I don't know about that - reading the fight, Jaina was dominating Caedus and would've ended him a few seconds into it had Caedus not taken advantage of a body right next to him. To the extent that Caedus did better, it was because of environmental maneuvering that showed Jaina's lesser skill and the fact that Invincible Caedus is more powerful than Inferno Caedus.

You can only amp a person as much as their body allows. It's not so much a case of Luke not being able to as him not wanting to Dorsk 81 her.

Jaina is a Skywalker; I doubt that her body would struggle to handle Dooku's power.

September 8th 2019, 11:44 am

The Ellimist wrote:

Greysentinel365 wrote:Probably 4

There's no way Dooku ~ Inferno-fight Luke.

You said it's "anyone's guess" to what level of power Luke was using in that fight in your blog Amped Jaina Solo runs the guantlet 1306544554

And it is, truly, anyone's guess.

The same goes for what level Luke is empowering Jaina to. If he holds back his full power in fear it's corruptive potential, why would he trust his full power in another person? Jaina feeling super empowered isn't of consequence when she's small potatoes as of LOTF, and an upgrade to Dooku level would be a huge boon.

I'm going to have to say 4.Dooku stops her because of his prestige and experience.

And also... I don't think Invincible Caedus is any stronger than Inferno!Caedus

September 8th 2019, 11:57 am

Ziggy wrote:You said it's "anyone's guess" to what level of power Luke was using in that fight in your blog

Lol, that doesn't literally mean he could have been Dooku level.

Jacen fought alongside Luke in TUF; he's not going to be expecting a Dooku-tier fighter. If he encountered a Dooku-tier fighter, he'd have been surprised that it was Luke.

I know you like to meme-lowball Jacen but no, amped Jaina doesn't stop at Dooku unless if she screws up (which I suppose is possible).

September 8th 2019, 2:47 pm

The Ellimist wrote:

Ziggy wrote:You said it's "anyone's guess" to what level of power Luke was using in that fight in your blog

Lol, that doesn't literally mean he could have been Dooku level.

As a member of the group "anyone" that was just my guess.

Perhaps at times, he performs to an even worse degree... such as in Tempest against Lumiya - where he lost. But even when he finally kills her in Sacrifice, she puts up a decent enough fight to confuse where he performs on a regular. It's not really in Lumiya's profile to be above someone like Dooku. And I'm pretty sure Azronger told me about a quote from Luke's perspective (LOTF) stating she's wasn't on Darth Vaders level. This makes sense... she was merely an Emperors thrall and not apprentice material to Palpatine.

If that's the case, it's interesting that she can put up such a valiant effort, despite being weaker than someone Luke matched/defeated in ROTJ...

Jacen fought alongside Luke in TUF; he's not going to be expecting a Dooku-tier fighter. If he encountered a Dooku-tier fighter, he'd have been surprised that it was Luke.

Sure he fought alongside Luke in TUF, but that was more than ten years ago. Perhaps when Caedus contemplates Luke's power he thinks of a younger man slaughtering wave upon wave of Vong skivvies and then their Overlord. Or he might be thinking about the older man he set a much much smaller group of YVH droids against with the distinct possibility those droids might kill him. But as the latter's a more recent affair... I'm going to go with that one :

Luke and Saba flanked Ben, their lightsabers up, and caught the barrages of blaster damage being hurled their way. Caedus waited, patient. They couldn’t sustain that amount of fire for very long. Either they’d die, or they’d figure out how to put the combat droids down fast.

Excerpt From: Aaron Allston. “Fury"

I know you like to meme-lowball Jacen but no, amped Jaina doesn't stop at Dooku unless if she screws up (which I suppose is possible).

I am saddened that you'd misinterpret my intentions so unjustly. I assure you, friend, these musings are in Good Faith^tm. I'm merely reiterating what you said before. While Luke's unbridled power is undeniable, it is anyone's guess where he performs on a regular. It is also truly anyone's guess to what Jacen thinks of that power. I personally don't trust his judgement, which leaves !Luke-amped Jaina! an anomaly. I'm left with no choice but to appeal to Dooku's own vast power, prestige and experience to say she stops there. And am willing to admit this might just be an assumption.

September 9th 2019, 3:33 pm

Down at 5 or 7.

September 10th 2019, 4:52 pm

Ziggy wrote:

The Ellimist wrote:

Ziggy wrote:You said it's "anyone's guess" to what level of power Luke was using in that fight in your blog

Lol, that doesn't literally mean he could have been Dooku level.

As a member of the group "anyone" that was just my guess.

Perhaps at times, he performs to an even worse degree... such as in Tempest against Lumiya - where he lost. But even when he finally kills her in Sacrifice, she puts up a decent enough fight to confuse where he performs on a regular. It's not really in Lumiya's profile to be above someone like Dooku. And I'm pretty sure Azronger told me about a quote from Luke's perspective (LOTF) stating she's wasn't on Darth Vaders level. This makes sense... she was merely an Emperors thrall and not apprentice material to Palpatine.

If that's the case, it's interesting that she can put up such a valiant effort, despite being weaker than someone Luke matched/defeated in ROTJ...

Jacen fought alongside Luke in TUF; he's not going to be expecting a Dooku-tier fighter. If he encountered a Dooku-tier fighter, he'd have been surprised that it was Luke.

Sure he fought alongside Luke in TUF, but that was more than ten years ago. Perhaps when Caedus contemplates Luke's power he thinks of a younger man slaughtering wave upon wave of Vong skivvies and then their Overlord. Or he might be thinking about the older man he set a much much smaller group of YVH droids against with the distinct possibility those droids might kill him. But as the latter's a more recent affair... I'm going to go with that one :

Luke and Saba flanked Ben, their lightsabers up, and caught the barrages of blaster damage being hurled their way. Caedus waited, patient. They couldn’t sustain that amount of fire for very long. Either they’d die, or they’d figure out how to put the combat droids down fast.

Excerpt From: Aaron Allston. “Fury"

I know you like to meme-lowball Jacen but no, amped Jaina doesn't stop at Dooku unless if she screws up (which I suppose is possible).

I am saddened that you'd misinterpret my intentions so unjustly. I assure you, friend, these musings are in Good Faith^tm. I'm merely reiterating what you said before. While Luke's unbridled power is undeniable, it is anyone's guess where he performs on a regular. It is also truly anyone's guess to what Jacen thinks of that power. I personally don't trust his judgement, which leaves !Luke-amped Jaina! an anomaly. I'm left with no choice but to appeal to Dooku's own vast power, prestige and experience to say she stops there. And am willing to admit this might just be an assumption.

Jacen is the one who commented to ~~the reader~~ Luke in TUF and DN that Luke's power was influenced by his fear of the dark side. He would therefore be pretty aware of that variable, but when he encounters not-Luke in Invincible, his immediate reaction is "Luke is going to stop at nothing to kill me because he knows I killed Mara". He does not seem to believe that Luke will hold back in fear of the dark side there. He had also been experiencing visions of Luke killing him and claiming his Empire for himself, so he seems to think that Luke is going to kill him and turn to the dark side. In either case, he certainly would not be expecting a Dooku-tier combatant to come after him (and why wouldn't Luke amp Jaina to a higher level than Dooku?).

September 10th 2019, 7:20 pm

Undermines own point in paragraph.

“Jacen thought Luke would stop at nothing to kill him, which totally means something.”

Also

“Caedus has been having nightmares about Luke constantly!”

Gee, it’s almost like he’s paranoid and his opinion can’t be taken as rational.

September 11th 2019, 1:35 am

Greysentinel365 wrote:Undermines own point in paragraph.

“Jacen thought Luke would stop at nothing to kill him, which totally means something.”

Also

“Caedus has been having nightmares about Luke constantly!”

Gee, it’s almost like he’s paranoid and his opinion can’t be taken as rational.

He wasn't "paranoid" in the conventional sense; Luke was literally manipulating his visions of the future so that he would see exactly that. But that his fear was inaccurate doesn't change the fact that he wouldn't expect a Dooku-tier combatant to come after him. Nor had Caedus lost his mental faculties; he was able to tactically out-maneuver Jaina, which is why he survived at all.

What reason is there to take the less straightforward and more convoluted interpretation that the Jaina who was specifically amped by Luke to appear to be Luke was actually several magnitudes weaker than the version of Luke that Jacen fought and was aware of?

Amped Jaina Solo runs the guantlet

Amped Jaina Solo runs the guantlet

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