Re: TPM Darth Sidious vs Darth Vader (ROTJ) and Galen Marek

December 17th 2019, 3:19 pm

BreakofDawn wrote:

Sidious wins in a blink. He's already blitzed someone faster than Vader in Maul.

@Azronger Out of curiosity, why is Maul > Vader in speed?

Lucas quotes.

December 17th 2019, 3:24 pm

Crippled half-man, half-machine comment was debunked by Lucas in 2005.

December 17th 2019, 4:08 pm

since u guys are more knowledgeable than me, can u guys help me find books and comics that lucas helped make? ive been thinking about this for awhile now, and comics/books that lucas helped make have more validity than the ones that were more 'independent' from him. the OT and prequels novels all fall into this, but what other comics and novels do as well? that might help solve some problems in inconsistency with quotes as well.

December 17th 2019, 5:18 pm

Lol at Vader getting ragdolled.

December 17th 2019, 5:20 pm

vader is prolly more powerful than this sheev tbh.

December 17th 2019, 5:36 pm

No he’s not, lol. Sheev is still more powerful, but it’s not ragdoll level difference.

December 17th 2019, 5:45 pm

vader is said to be nearly as powerful as ROTJ sheev. u literally read the RT zapan made lol

December 17th 2019, 6:09 pm

Sheev, easily.

December 18th 2019, 1:13 am

BreakofDawn wrote:Crippled half-man, half-machine comment was debunked by Lucas in 2005.

Not referring to that. Unless I'm mistaken, he's never retconned the speed aspect of the comments.

December 18th 2019, 7:19 am

Do you have a quote?

December 18th 2019, 9:46 am

Sidious wins, but he does not ragdoll Vader.

December 18th 2019, 3:58 pm

EmperorCaedus wrote:Sidious wins, but he does not ragdoll Vader.

December 18th 2019, 10:54 pm

100 percent ragdolls Vader.

December 19th 2019, 7:52 am

Meatpants wrote:100 percent ragdolls Vader.

How?

December 19th 2019, 7:56 am

i sometimes wonder why i even make thise blogs lol

December 19th 2019, 9:11 am

Perhaps your blog is wrong? Which it is.

December 19th 2019, 9:12 am

Look Lorenzo, I am one of the biggest Vader defenders on this site but your wank is beyond reason.

December 19th 2019, 9:14 am

@HellfireUnit @Meatpants Not trying to take a side here, but why does Sidious ragdoll Vader? Dominate him, yes, but ragdoll?

December 19th 2019, 9:17 am

BreakofDawn wrote:@HellfireUnit @Meatpants Not trying to take a side here, but why does Sidious ragdoll Vader? Dominate him, yes, but ragdoll?

There's no evidence Sidious was going beyond his body to ragdoll Luke, who's explicitly equal to Vader in the Force. Lucas also implies heavily that Sidious could have dealt with both of them without trouble. Since TPM Sidious reached his potential in the Force as far as I'm aware, I see no reason why the result would be any different.

December 19th 2019, 9:20 am

There's no evidence Sidious was going beyond his body to ragdoll Luke,

An older, more experienced and more powerful Sidious.

who's explicitly equal to Vader in the Force.

Contradicted multiple times, including by a novel Lucas himself edited. Lucas also has several quotes suggesting Vader > Luke. The only area Lucas appears to support them being equal in is sabers.

Lucas also implies heavily that Sidious could have dealt with both of them without trouble.

Again, assuming they are equal which is rather contradictory, and also contradicted in itself by Lucas.

Since TPM Sidious reached his potential in the Force as far as I'm aware, I see no reason why the result would be any different.

The darkness hindering the Jedi's abilities and precognition/visions grew between TPM and ROTS, indicating that he continued to grow.

December 19th 2019, 9:23 am

https://www.suspectinsightforums.com/t387-ss-darth-plagueis-meatpants-vs-galen-marek-arkhamasylum3

Explained here. Sidious growing in power is not mutually exclusive with him being restricted by how much power he can channel without overloading his body. That restriction applies from TPM all the way to DE.

December 19th 2019, 9:28 am

Which still does not answer my question. We have multiple sources (including one approved by Lucas and some from Lucas himself) suggesting that Vader > Luke as a Force user but = him in sabers, so how does ragdolling Luke mean he could ragdoll Vader?

December 19th 2019, 9:29 am

It may not be a ragdoll but Sheev does dominate Vader. He outclasses Vader in every area except for durability. His arsenal is too much for Vader to handle. He can surely tank his lightning but combined with Palpatine's exceptional skill and speed, he cannot keep up with all of these and the limitations of his suit doesn't make it any easier for him.

December 19th 2019, 9:30 am

BreakofDawn wrote:Which still does not answer my question. We have multiple sources (including one approved by Lucas and some from Lucas himself) suggesting that Vader > Luke as a Force user but = him in sabers, so how does ragdolling Luke mean he could ragdoll Vader?

I don't understand why that's relevant even if it was true. Unless Vader is significantly more powerful than Luke, he's getting ragdolled. Notwithstanding that Lucas basically said Sidious could have dealt with both easily, and that's the intent you get from watching the movie and just common sense.

December 19th 2019, 9:44 am

my wank? dude, i made a blog explaining it lol i actually low balled kriff to not make it wanky hahaha i havent even gotten into the speed and force ability sections yet. Vader can beat Sheev by himself.