Ahsoka Tano (TCW S2) vs. Ezra Bridger

Ahsoka as of The Clone Wars: Season 2; Ezra as of Star Wars Rebels: Season 4; setting is Dantooine. Who wins?

Ahsoka Stomps lmao

Ezra is more powerful but Ahsoka is probably more skilled. Leaning Ezra.

BreakofDawn wrote:Ezra is more powerful but Ahsoka is probably more skilled. Leaning Ezra.

You get my PM?

Probably Ezra

King Joker wrote:

BreakofDawn wrote:Ezra is more powerful but Ahsoka is probably more skilled. Leaning Ezra.

You get my PM?

Will reply in a few minutes. Been rushing the last few days.

I see Ezra possibly having a knowledge edge here due to him studying under Kanan, from a Jedi holocron, and from a Sith Holocron. Ezra may have a raw power edge, but since his natural talent lies more in mental aspects of the Force, it's pretty hard to accurately compare the two. And since this is Season 2 Ahsoka, it's even likely Ezra has an edge in lightsaber combat, as Ahsoka has very little to her name that early in the Clone Wars. Ezra has at least become Kanan's equal as a swordsman by the end of Season 2 (as seen in their training session, where Ezra points out that they've reached a draw multiple times), and has been depicted out-dueling the Seventh Sister, a former Jedi. Ahsoka by this point has been repeatedly tooled by Ventress, and badly beaten by Grievous. Neither of those are very impressive showings for her in comparison to Ezra's. 

Now, if this was Season 5 Ahsoka, she'd stomp Ezra pretty convincingly, judging by her performance against Grievous in their second fight.

Ezra has at least become Kanan's equal as a swordsman by the end of Season 2 (as seen in their training session, where Ezra points out that they've reached a draw multiple times),

Kanan was holding back pretty considerably.

BreakofDawn wrote:

Ezra has at least become Kanan's equal as a swordsman by the end of Season 2 (as seen in their training session, where Ezra points out that they've reached a draw multiple times),

Kanan was holding back pretty considerably.

Do we know that definitively? Like, is there an actual source that states this? Because I haven't seen one. Why would he be holding back so much if the goal was to train until they were both ready to face Inquisitors? They were even using a safety setting on their lightsabers, so it's not like Ezra was likely to be injured in training.

Kanan's performance against the Eighth Brother wasn't all that much above Ezra's against the Seventh Sister. Kanan himself didn't even finish his training, an issue he brings up often. I don't find it improbable at all that Ezra with two years of training could rival Kanan as a swordsman, especially when Kanan is pushing Ezra to be able to match Inquisitors.

Do we know that definitively? Like, is there an actual source that states this? Because I haven't seen one. Why would he be holding back so much if the goal was to train until they were both ready to face Inquisitors? They were even using a safety setting on their lightsabers, so it's not like Ezra was likely to be injured in training.

Simple comparisons. Compare their performances against the Inquisitors for one. Also, I'm pretty sure they weren't using safety settings. We also know season 3 Kanan > season 3 Ezra in skill despite both growing a lot.

Kanan's performance against the Eighth Brother wasn't all that much above Ezra's against the Seventh Sister.

I assume you're talking about Malachor? Ezra was tapping into the dark side pretty heavily during that fight and he wasn't close to beating the Sister, only drove her back a bit before Maul ragdolled her. Kanan outright outmatched the Eight Brother.

Kanan himself didn't even finish his training, an issue he brings up often.

Having years of formal training by a Jedi Council member > being trained by a former padawan/just turned knight with no experience in teaching.

I don't find it improbable at all that Ezra with two years of training could rival Kanan as a swordsman, especially when Kanan is pushing Ezra to be able to match Inquisitors.

Another comparison is base Ezra getting stomped by the 7th Sister in their first fight on the medical frigate vs Kanan doing pretty well against her every time they fought.

BreakofDawn wrote:

Do we know that definitively? Like, is there an actual source that states this? Because I haven't seen one. Why would he be holding back so much if the goal was to train until they were both ready to face Inquisitors? They were even using a safety setting on their lightsabers, so it's not like Ezra was likely to be injured in training.

Simple comparisons. Compare their performances against the Inquisitors for one. Also, I'm pretty sure they weren't using safety settings. We also know season 3 Kanan > season 3 Ezra in skill despite both growing a lot.

Kanan's performance against the Eighth Brother wasn't all that much above Ezra's against the Seventh Sister.

I assume you're talking about Malachor? Ezra was tapping into the dark side pretty heavily during that fight and he wasn't close to beating the Sister, only drove her back a bit before Maul ragdolled her. Kanan outright outmatched the Eight Brother.

Kanan himself didn't even finish his training, an issue he brings up often.

Having years of formal training by a Jedi Council member > being trained by a former padawan/just turned knight with no experience in teaching.

I don't find it improbable at all that Ezra with two years of training could rival Kanan as a swordsman, especially when Kanan is pushing Ezra to be able to match Inquisitors.

Another comparison is base Ezra getting stomped by the 7th Sister in their first fight on the medical frigate vs Kanan doing pretty well against her every time they fought.

They were absolutely using training settings. Their lightsabers were a different color, the hum was different, and a strike to the wall left no visible damage. 

Yes, it's true that Ezra gave into the dark side against the Seventh Sister, but the fact remains that he was driving her back until Maul intervened. We didn't get to see the full fight play out because Maul stopped it before it could continue, but the Seventh Sister seemed to be putting up pretty much no resistance against S2 finale Ezra. Meanwhile, the Eighth brother landed a kick on Kanan, and initially drove Kanan back before Kanan took the edge. Even then, the two seemed to be fighting evenly until Kanan landed a strike on the rim of the Eighth Brother's lightsaber. The Eighth Brother could have continued dueling Kanan, but at that point he was outnumbered 3 to 1, with the other two combatants being Ahsoka and Maul. 

Kanan didn't have "years" of training under Depa Billaba. The Kanan comic makes it clear he only trained under her for a few months, much of which was formal training inside the temple. He only went on two or three actual missions with her. Ezra by Season 2's finale had seen more live combat than Kanan by the time of Order 66. 

Yes, it's true Ezra got stomped by the 7th sister in their first fight, but that's hardly relevant. Ezra had almost a full year of significant growth after that fight before he faced her again, and another two years of major growth after that. This is one of the most inaccurate comparisons I've seen. It's like trying to argue Starkiller would beat DE Luke just because Starkiller did better against Vader than ESB Luke did. Luke clearly experienced massive growth after being solidly defeated in that early encounter. Same case here. Ezra was stomped early on in his Jedi training, but he had three years of major growth after that, making his early showing irrelevant to this debate.

Will reply later.

BreakofDawn wrote:Will reply later.

No rush. I should honestly be asleep right now anyway.

Ashhhoka wins

Ezra wins. 

Kanan and Ezra are on the same level in S2. Filoni even says so IIRC

Greysentinel365 wrote:Ezra wins. 

Kanan and Ezra are on the same level in S2. Filoni even says so IIRC

Quote/link?

— — —

If anyone would like to do an S.S. with me on this topic, I’d be down. 

I can never tell when GreySentinel is serious or when he isn't

Grey's too busy ragdolling people to have a sense of humour.

Honestly I don't even know if "Grey ragdolling" thing is troll thing since he truly ragdolled me twice.

It started out with me being serious, then became a meme adopted by everybody later.

Underachiever599 wrote:I see Ezra possibly having a knowledge edge here due to him studying under Kanan, from a Jedi holocron, and from a Sith Holocron.

This is almost certainly not the case. Being raised in the Jedi Temple, with access to the Order's wisest minds, skilled instructors, and depth of archives would have given Ahsoka a phenomenal foundation of both traditional, academic understanding of the Force and practical applications through years of routine training. From the tutelage of Anakin Skywalker, someone of prodigious skill and intuitive understanding of the Force (with over a decade of classical training under Obi-Wan Kenobi), I'd wager that Ahsoka's master's instruction and example weighs far heavier than the scraps of knowledge Kanan could have brought to the table of Ezra's training. A Sith holocron of dubious combative relevance or wisdom is not changing this equation.

Underachiever599 wrote:Ezra may have a raw power edge, but since his natural talent lies more in mental aspects of the Force, it's pretty hard to accurately compare the two. And since this is Season 2 Ahsoka, it's even likely Ezra has an edge in lightsaber combat, as Ahsoka has very little to her name that early in the Clone Wars. Ezra has at least become Kanan's equal as a swordsman by the end of Season 2 (as seen in their training session, where Ezra points out that they've reached a draw multiple times), and has been depicted out-dueling the Seventh Sister, a former Jedi. Ahsoka by this point has been repeatedly tooled by Ventress, and badly beaten by Grievous. Neither of those are very impressive showings for her in comparison to Ezra's. 

Hm, I'd agree with the basic premise that Ezra and Ahsoka should be relatively close in combative ability at this point in their lives, but I think you may be underselling Ahsoka a bit in your evaluation. While Ahsoka was terribly outmatched against Grievous and Ventress, she performed admirably against them. After regaining her footing in her initial bout with the General, she performed well enough to frustrate him and escape his grasp; likewise, with Asajj Ventress, Ahsoka proved to be competent aid to Luminara against an adversary who was notably adept at engaging with highly skilled duos (Anakin Skywalker and Obi-Wan Kenobi) for impressive lengths of time. In addition to Ahsoka's lightsaber skill, she's also showcased blatantly superior unarmed combat skills [1] [2], and in direct comparisons of Ahsoka and Ezra's performance against droidekas, Ezra's inexperience shines through.

As far as Ezra's dueling showings go, it's quite obvious that Ezra only gained the upper-hand against the Seventh Sister while tapping into his darker emotions at the behest of Maul. Ezra never legitimately outdueled her (or any Inquisitor, for that matter). Ezra's spar with Kanan is impressive and demonstrates his fast learning curve, but I question the validity of using it as proof that Ezra is actually on Kanan's level, as Ezra was shown to be the one particularly vulnerable member against the Inquisitors on Malachor.