TCW S4 Darth Maul vs Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi

Darth Maul, as of the very end of the episode Revenge, travels back in time to 32BBY thanks Avengers Endgame time travel technique, and replaces TPM Maul in the fight against Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi.

• Maul has his single bladed lightsaber.
  
• They fight in the same Theed hangar.
  
• Maul retains his memories of what happened when his 22 year old self fought the duo.
  
• Duo does not get confused at why Maul suddenly has a cybernetic lower half.
  

• No cheap shots or CIS.
  

How does it go?

The duo. 

Maul's technique was very wild and showing a lot of rust when he fought Kenobi in the turtle tanker. TPM Maul's agility and likely the unusual nature of the double-bladed lightsaber was a key factor in keeping the duo at bay and outmanoeuvring them. Here Kenobi was outmanoeuvring him and had him dead to rights but thanks to CIS he didn't press his advantage and instead helped Ventress. If the duo goes at him hard with everything they got to end it quickly as they attempted in the novel, they should be successful.

O-Siri wrote:The duo. 

Maul's technique was very wild and showing a lot of rust when he fought Kenobi in the turtle tanker. TPM Maul's agility and likely the unusual nature of the double-bladed lightsaber was a key factor in keeping the duo at bay and outmanoeuvring them. Here Kenobi was outmanoeuvring him and had him dead to rights but thanks to CIS he didn't press his advantage and instead helped Ventress. If the duo goes at him hard with everything they got to end it quickly as they attempted in the novel, they should be successful.

The OP stipulates that this is Maul at the end of that episode, when he had adapted old fighting style to his new legs. Maul was initially losing because he wasn’t able to instantly adapt his old fighting style to his new legs, but he did once Kenobi retrieved his blue lightsaber.

Very well. If we assume he was successful in incorporating his old H2H skills into his legs and is completely over the rust he should hold the advantage as he did in TPM. Despite the absence of the double-bladed lightsaber, the legs are a great range weapon once Maul has gotten used to them and similarly awkward for first-time opponents.

O-Siri wrote:Very well. If we assume he was successful in incorporating his old H2H skills into his legs and is completely over the rust he should hold the advantage as he did in TPM. Despite the absence of the double-bladed lightsaber, the legs are a great range weapon once Maul has gotten used to them and similarly awkward for first-time opponents.

He definitely got over the rust by the end of the episode, but his H2H skills with those legs definitely diminished. There was this Forcecast or Rebels Force podcast/interview that Filoni made a comparison between Maul's velicoraptor legs and his mandalorian legs, saying that the former severely hampered his ability to perform acrobatics and martial arts in lightsaber combat whereas his mandalorian legs allowed him to. I can't find them the video anymore because YouTube removed it (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJUWUdw-Yis&feature=youtu.be), but the explanation makes sense because his mandalorian legs are the same size as his original legs, which Maul spent many years relying on for his acrobatics and martial arts, but lacked that intimiate knowledge with velociraptor legs because he only had them for a few months at best, and they're also a lot bigger.

That complicates things then because I think his agility and ability to dance around them was crucial in his success at keeping both of them at bay while simultaneously laying the pressure on them. 

Still, when Maul abuses them those raptor legs are quite effective and he did seem to have some measure of his martial ability as when he kicked Kenobi in their first rematch. 

I think I'll still tentatively back Maul.

O-Siri wrote:That complicates things then because I think his agility and ability to dance around them was crucial in his success at keeping both of them at bay while simultaneously laying the pressure on them. 

Still, when Maul abuses them those raptor legs are quite effective and he did seem to have some measure of his martial ability as when he kicked Kenobi in their first rematch. 

I think I'll still tentatively back Maul.

Yeah, it sounds like Maul's velicoraptor legs gave him the ability to deliver more powerful kicks, but that came at the expense of diminishing his agility/mobility and martial skill. I'd say the latter are much more useful.

Bump.

Maul

A little birdy made me privy to this interview...



Maul as of S4 is a far more formidable foe than Opress, and as a duo they are unrivalled by any other team. Pretty nifty. I have no doubt that S4 Maul would still clean house.

We have a quote saying S4 Maul's former power was "restored", but that quote never stated that his power was capped at that level; we just know he got all of his old power back. We do have quotes stating that the ordeal on Lotho Minor and his subsequent body-and-mind healing from Talzin both served to strengthen his connection to the dark side, so if anything, he's more powerful now, which is only logical. So a more powerful, more experienced, more determined, more calculating, more vindictive Maul with two new extremely powerful legs capable of overpowering Savage Opress, ragdolling Kenobi, oneshotting Bruu Jun Fan and snapping Judd's arm? A Maul who by virtue of his skill and training is a "far more formidable" foe than Savage Opress who is just coming off his impressive showings S3? No way he loses this.

@ILS: S4 Maul doesn't have his saberstaff in this scenario though, he only has a single blade and dealing with Jinn and Kenobi is going to be a pain in the ass if he only has a single blade. But regardless, here's more stuff that reinforces what Insider says about Maul's sizable superiority over Savage:

Dave Filoni: And then Savage is a very poorly trained Dark Side wielder. He's all... He's all aggression and power. He's kind of like the Hulk - but he doesn't have a lot of discipline, he doesn't have a lot of know how. Maul is a super dangerous threat because he’s been trained for years, he’s really adept, but he’s broken. So he’s kind of in the Vader-realm, and he’s a bit severed from what he knew, which was having a master, but he’s well trained by Sidious in all types of Sith ways, not the least of which is manipulation.

Source -- Weekly ForceCast: May 4, 2012

Filoni is making a pretty clear difference between the threat levels that Maul and Savage present. Savage is a poorly trained Dark Sider that relies on aggression and strength, lacking discipline and knowledge, like the mindless Hulk, whereas Maul much more dangerous threat akin to Vader because he was well trained for many years by Sidious himself. Ergo, S4 Maul is superior to Savage even before going through his power growth.

This source reinforces it even further, saying that Savage has always been inferior to Maul:

"Noting the growing power of the brothers, Sidious confronts Savage Opress and Maul on Mandalore. As he dies, Opress expresses regret that he was never Maul's equal." ― Ultimate Star Wars New Edition: The Definitive Guide to the Star Wars Universe (2019).

You are doing Sheev's work, my son. May his Majesty bless your every endeavour.

maul

Maul wins even faster due to his legs. He had no trouble landing kicks on the duo and now he has blades on his toes.